This session is all about polishing your manuscript or book proposal, taking a close look at your first 50 pages (fiction) or writing sample (non-fiction).
Thank you for this brilliant starter, Caro - this has already inspired me to start putting together my "chapter outlines" for my memoir. I have been resisting going this way, and sent out already to two agents who look at memoir more like fiction, and ask for first three chapters, because I have already written it (and edited it, and re-written it.. etc). I am an admitted pantser, so plotting and planning have historically been my bêtes noires. I am struggling with comp titles, and that is something else I need to attack, as so far I have only come up with one, which I can only compare mine to as "theirs, only on steroids". I have to admit, you absolutely grabbed me at "Are you choosing not to put speech marks because you want to look fancy3 or do you have a valid reason for doing so?" - I have been the woman huffing about The Bee Sting's descent into punctuation madness, much to the amusement of everyone else in my book club. Thank you again - this has given me an invigorated push to polish this submission package, and we're only at the first lesson!
I am so glad, Kay! And I do really feel a chapter outline is needed for non-fiction as we never know how to weigh each theme otherwise. It is a bit harder to find things after the writing but I do feel it's worth going back over what you've done to see how it goes.
Good news for you as this week's post will break down comps so hopefully we'll find some!!
I can already see the value of it, Caro - just seeing, as you say, the weight of each part in comparison is very interesting. Ooooh I’m looking forward to hearing about comps!
This is so concise and helpful, Caro. And really good to place fiction against nonfiction because I think a lot of people don't know how distinctly different they are at submission (and as forms!). I, personally, was interested to see that for a nonfiction proposal it's okay to give extracts that represent the book, rather than the first three chapters - a full chapter to demonstrate you can write a narrative, and then possibly extracts from elsewhere. But I was also interested to read that you think the whole book needs to be plotted out before you submit. I wonder if this is true of someone like me who has a track record - ie, a memoir that did well and another nonfiction book on the way (published in 2025). An editor has asked me to write a proposal for a new book idea she is interested in, and I am still at the early stages. I am aiming to send her about 10,000 words of sample writing and a proposal plotting the book with themes and approach, and market, but the structure I always find difficult to pin down before I have written a first draft at least. I know this will be particular to each agent / editor - but would you advise I be as cautious with my submission as I would if I was a first time author... it will be the first proposal she will have ever received from me.
Thank you so much, Lily! And I'm so happy it's been helpful!
Regarding your query - I don't think you'll need to demonstrate you are able to write a full length memoir/narrative non-fiction in this proposal with a long writing sample as a debut writer would. Your track record speaks for itself! I do think you may need to have a detailed chapter outline. It always depends on editors and how senior they are, but I've been finding that the editors can be super supportive and happy with what you send, but they need authors to develop their proposals to get it past acquisitions and their colleagues in Sales, Rights and Campaigns. I have been in a few situations where we all agreed on everything but Sales still requested a tweaked proposal to be able to offer any numbers.
For structure (which I'll go in details in my January course so forgive the brevity here), I always find that laying down every themes on a page and then grouping them by themes works for me (though I should flag I have a specific kind of neurospicy brain that sees patterns and organises structure really easily so may just be what works for me!). Happy to have a chat and talk through structure at some point? It's genuinely my favourite thing about proposals!
This is super helpful, thank you. I always struggle over structure. it's something I tend to find through the writing - but I also really really like it, too, and feel kind of thrilled by the prospect of making patterns that feel just right... only I guess I feel I have to find them rather than force them. You're very kind to offer your time like this Caro. I might take you up on a chat a bit later in the day. I do have an agent, but she's not brilliant on the editorial stuff - and I have suffered in the past from sending out proposals that were a little half baked, so i really need to get this one right.
Oh that sounds great! Well I think I will do some thorough break down of how to find patterns when I do my course in January so we can discuss then. Usually, I find that writers get bogged down by having too many themes and topics that feel like they're fighting but are actually on a symbolic or deeper level, all linked.
My advice is to write down literally everything in your head about the book, then to follow the 60 / 30 / 10 rule (which I have just made up by the way!! I would usually say 70/30 for core theme and secondary theme, but harder when you don't have that structure in place yet):
60% - this is your core topic so if it's memoir, add all your ideas in this section. It should be summarised in one sentence as the heart of what you're trying to achieve in this book.
30% - that's your second strand, it could be health, science, self development, nature etc. Add everything to do with that in here. That's the strand of non-fiction that isn't the same as your first category, but that will add weight or arguments to support your first section.
10% - That's your wild card themes, everything that doesn't fall in category one or two goes here. Some of these topics, you will remove altogether from this project, others will be woven into one and two.
See how you get on with this and let me know! How many strands of narrative are you battling against? The chapter outline should start from a small concise idea and bloom into a varied, layered narrative. Starting with a lot of theme is harder to tame into one core idea.
I love this Caro and have just applied it to my own work in progress and I was amazed how easily it fitted your 60/30/10 rule. I'm all about the braid at the moment (i'm using wildflowers as a metaphor) so I love that sneaky little 10% in there. All of this is so helpful, even for those of us who have written many books. Thank you.
This is sooo helpful, Caro! I have one core theme/ idea / which is very strong… the problem i am having is that it exposes a lot of very intimate personal stuff to do it justice in the memoir bit so I am trying to work out how much i can get away with not writing or writing obliquely.. this is why I’m stalling a bit i think (without it feeling like I am withholding). But I love the idea of there being that other 30 % and I haven’t yet worked out what that is, as in something that is different from the first category. Well, actually, I do have an idea!
In terms of the narrative strands… there is one strong one with forward momentum that runs forward from ten years ago. The second main one will be made up of flashbacks… And then if I do go for this other ‘nonfiction’ idea - the 30% (or 20%) - that will be in fragments.
Have you seen the film adaptation of The Outrun yet? It absolutely encapsulates what you state here - the main strand of the protagonist returning home, flashbacks of her drunk days in London, interspersed with informational bits about wild coastal landscapes, and science, and weather, and alcoholism….
This gives me a lot to think about. I am so grateful… thank you.
In this instance, I would probably emphasise the fact that writing and publishing are two different things and you may want the freedom to write about the topic without thinking about what you want to share and not want to share, and then do a pass at the end to remove anything you feel uncomfortable sharing. I do think separating both processes - especially when writing memoir - is essential in the crafting because it's easier to remove details than to stop yourself working an angle / getting an insight you wouldn't have had if you worried about the personal stuff.
I haven't seen The Outrun yet but I worked at Canongate when it was published - one of my favourite books (and the reason I started falling in love with nature writing and ended up co-founding the Nan Shepherd Prize!!) and one of the one with a fascinating structure. Did you hear her editor Jenny Lord talk about the editing? Her and Amy completely changed the structure int he editing: https://shows.acast.com/what-editors-want/episodes/weidenfeld-and-nicolson-jenny-lord
Thank you for this brilliant starter, Caro - this has already inspired me to start putting together my "chapter outlines" for my memoir. I have been resisting going this way, and sent out already to two agents who look at memoir more like fiction, and ask for first three chapters, because I have already written it (and edited it, and re-written it.. etc). I am an admitted pantser, so plotting and planning have historically been my bêtes noires. I am struggling with comp titles, and that is something else I need to attack, as so far I have only come up with one, which I can only compare mine to as "theirs, only on steroids". I have to admit, you absolutely grabbed me at "Are you choosing not to put speech marks because you want to look fancy3 or do you have a valid reason for doing so?" - I have been the woman huffing about The Bee Sting's descent into punctuation madness, much to the amusement of everyone else in my book club. Thank you again - this has given me an invigorated push to polish this submission package, and we're only at the first lesson!
I am so glad, Kay! And I do really feel a chapter outline is needed for non-fiction as we never know how to weigh each theme otherwise. It is a bit harder to find things after the writing but I do feel it's worth going back over what you've done to see how it goes.
Good news for you as this week's post will break down comps so hopefully we'll find some!!
I can already see the value of it, Caro - just seeing, as you say, the weight of each part in comparison is very interesting. Ooooh I’m looking forward to hearing about comps!
This is so concise and helpful, Caro. And really good to place fiction against nonfiction because I think a lot of people don't know how distinctly different they are at submission (and as forms!). I, personally, was interested to see that for a nonfiction proposal it's okay to give extracts that represent the book, rather than the first three chapters - a full chapter to demonstrate you can write a narrative, and then possibly extracts from elsewhere. But I was also interested to read that you think the whole book needs to be plotted out before you submit. I wonder if this is true of someone like me who has a track record - ie, a memoir that did well and another nonfiction book on the way (published in 2025). An editor has asked me to write a proposal for a new book idea she is interested in, and I am still at the early stages. I am aiming to send her about 10,000 words of sample writing and a proposal plotting the book with themes and approach, and market, but the structure I always find difficult to pin down before I have written a first draft at least. I know this will be particular to each agent / editor - but would you advise I be as cautious with my submission as I would if I was a first time author... it will be the first proposal she will have ever received from me.
Thank you so much, Lily! And I'm so happy it's been helpful!
Regarding your query - I don't think you'll need to demonstrate you are able to write a full length memoir/narrative non-fiction in this proposal with a long writing sample as a debut writer would. Your track record speaks for itself! I do think you may need to have a detailed chapter outline. It always depends on editors and how senior they are, but I've been finding that the editors can be super supportive and happy with what you send, but they need authors to develop their proposals to get it past acquisitions and their colleagues in Sales, Rights and Campaigns. I have been in a few situations where we all agreed on everything but Sales still requested a tweaked proposal to be able to offer any numbers.
For structure (which I'll go in details in my January course so forgive the brevity here), I always find that laying down every themes on a page and then grouping them by themes works for me (though I should flag I have a specific kind of neurospicy brain that sees patterns and organises structure really easily so may just be what works for me!). Happy to have a chat and talk through structure at some point? It's genuinely my favourite thing about proposals!
This is super helpful, thank you. I always struggle over structure. it's something I tend to find through the writing - but I also really really like it, too, and feel kind of thrilled by the prospect of making patterns that feel just right... only I guess I feel I have to find them rather than force them. You're very kind to offer your time like this Caro. I might take you up on a chat a bit later in the day. I do have an agent, but she's not brilliant on the editorial stuff - and I have suffered in the past from sending out proposals that were a little half baked, so i really need to get this one right.
Oh that sounds great! Well I think I will do some thorough break down of how to find patterns when I do my course in January so we can discuss then. Usually, I find that writers get bogged down by having too many themes and topics that feel like they're fighting but are actually on a symbolic or deeper level, all linked.
My advice is to write down literally everything in your head about the book, then to follow the 60 / 30 / 10 rule (which I have just made up by the way!! I would usually say 70/30 for core theme and secondary theme, but harder when you don't have that structure in place yet):
60% - this is your core topic so if it's memoir, add all your ideas in this section. It should be summarised in one sentence as the heart of what you're trying to achieve in this book.
30% - that's your second strand, it could be health, science, self development, nature etc. Add everything to do with that in here. That's the strand of non-fiction that isn't the same as your first category, but that will add weight or arguments to support your first section.
10% - That's your wild card themes, everything that doesn't fall in category one or two goes here. Some of these topics, you will remove altogether from this project, others will be woven into one and two.
See how you get on with this and let me know! How many strands of narrative are you battling against? The chapter outline should start from a small concise idea and bloom into a varied, layered narrative. Starting with a lot of theme is harder to tame into one core idea.
I love this Caro and have just applied it to my own work in progress and I was amazed how easily it fitted your 60/30/10 rule. I'm all about the braid at the moment (i'm using wildflowers as a metaphor) so I love that sneaky little 10% in there. All of this is so helpful, even for those of us who have written many books. Thank you.
Oh I am so glad, Anna!!
This is sooo helpful, Caro! I have one core theme/ idea / which is very strong… the problem i am having is that it exposes a lot of very intimate personal stuff to do it justice in the memoir bit so I am trying to work out how much i can get away with not writing or writing obliquely.. this is why I’m stalling a bit i think (without it feeling like I am withholding). But I love the idea of there being that other 30 % and I haven’t yet worked out what that is, as in something that is different from the first category. Well, actually, I do have an idea!
In terms of the narrative strands… there is one strong one with forward momentum that runs forward from ten years ago. The second main one will be made up of flashbacks… And then if I do go for this other ‘nonfiction’ idea - the 30% (or 20%) - that will be in fragments.
Have you seen the film adaptation of The Outrun yet? It absolutely encapsulates what you state here - the main strand of the protagonist returning home, flashbacks of her drunk days in London, interspersed with informational bits about wild coastal landscapes, and science, and weather, and alcoholism….
This gives me a lot to think about. I am so grateful… thank you.
In this instance, I would probably emphasise the fact that writing and publishing are two different things and you may want the freedom to write about the topic without thinking about what you want to share and not want to share, and then do a pass at the end to remove anything you feel uncomfortable sharing. I do think separating both processes - especially when writing memoir - is essential in the crafting because it's easier to remove details than to stop yourself working an angle / getting an insight you wouldn't have had if you worried about the personal stuff.
I haven't seen The Outrun yet but I worked at Canongate when it was published - one of my favourite books (and the reason I started falling in love with nature writing and ended up co-founding the Nan Shepherd Prize!!) and one of the one with a fascinating structure. Did you hear her editor Jenny Lord talk about the editing? Her and Amy completely changed the structure int he editing: https://shows.acast.com/what-editors-want/episodes/weidenfeld-and-nicolson-jenny-lord
Jenny was my editor for sins of my father! I’ll take a look at that. Thank you
Oh of course! Jenny is one of the best editors, I love her taste 😍
One of the first things she said to me was ‘I am very discerning’!!